The Congressional Globe, Volume 14: Twenty-Eighth Congress, Second Session Page: 46
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46
28th Cong.. ..2d Sess.
APPENDIX TO THE CONGRESSIONAL GLOBE.
tied ia open day, and on the floors of Congress, or
before the-people at large, and not in any committee
room, able and well disposed as its members might
happen to be. s
But/in the present stage of the business, being
compelled' to vote between the reference to the Com-
mittee on Territories or that on Foreign Relations,
ne should prefer the former, as more agreeable to
the author of the bill, and the most appropriate of
the two for examining its details.
Mr. MOREHEAD observed that when a bill of
this nature several sessions ago passed the Senate,
he believed the only material question which arose,
was that of the supposed conflict of some of the
provisions of the biU with our foreign relations, or
the tendency growing out of those provisions to
produce collision with the British government. So
far as the provisions of that bill, constituting merely
a territorial government, were concerned, hethought
there were no material objections made on any side.
The point of difficulty, or the main point, and that
which was the principal subject of discussion, was,
whether certain provisions of the bill were not so
far in conflict with the treaty between Great Britain
and the United States, as to justify cause of com-
plaint on the part of the former government. For
one, he was of opinion that the provisions did not
furnish any just cause of dissatisfaction. He,
therefore, gave it his most hearty and willing sup-
port- He had not seen the present bill; but in all
probability it was pretty-much, in form and spirit,
the same as that of the late lamented senator from
Missouri [Mr. Linn.] If so, and the aspect of the
case had not changed since, he did not see that it
could interfere with our foreign relations; but there
was now pending a negotiation, and it appeared
very manifest to him that the view taken by the
honorable senator from Virginia [Mr. Archer]
wae the correct one. As to the provisions of the
bill, so far as they merely related to the jurisdiction
over the territory, and to facilitating emigration to
the country, he did not know that there was any
difficulty on that subject on the part of any mem-
ber of the Senate. Neither did he know, indeed
he was far from being advised, that the bill, if refer-
red to the Committee on Foreign Relations, would
fall into hostile hands. For one, he was very free
to say, that if there had been no charge'in the aspect
of the circumstances under which the bill was before
presented, he know of no reason why he should
change his views. But in the opinion of the chair-
man of the Committee on Foreign Relations, there
are difficulties growing out of a change of circum-
stances, which can be better solved by a reference of
the subject to the committee having charge of our
foreign relations, than by a committee having n©
charge or jurisdiction over them. So far as anything
has been yetdone, there would be no difficulty in es-
tablishing a territorial government.
He hoped, therefore, that the bill would be rfer-
red to the Committee on Foreign Relations. That
subject comes properly within the scope of the du-
ties of that committee, and no doubt it would there
receive a very candid and fair consideration. It
was for these reasons he hoped it would be refer-
red to that committee.
Mr. BUCHANAN said he was a member of the
Committee on Foreign Relations, and, in his hum-
ble judgment, the reference of this measure ought
not to be to that committee, but to the Committee
on Territories. What was the object of this bill?
It was to perfect a system of organization for a new
territory of the United Stctes; and if there was any
subject peculiarly appropriate to the Committee on
Territories, this was emphatically so. He thought his
friend from Virginia [Mr. Archer] had anticipated
in this matter. A tune might arise, and probably
would arise, when it might bean important ques-
tion how far certain provisions of this bill in'eifered
with the pending negotiations; but until a measure
is matured in all its details—until a bill is before the
Senate, after having undergone the supervision of
an appropriate committee-—that question could not,
in his humble judgment, properly arise. The Com-
mittee on Foreign Relations certainly is not the com-
mittee to enter into the details of a territorial bill;
and the simple point which they may hereafter be
called upon to decide is, how far this bill, in its de-
tails, may interfere with the existing negotiation:
but we must first have the bill, and must first have
it organized. Now, in regard to several important
subjects entered into in this bill, it was impossible
that there could be any doubt hi the minds of sen-
ators. Ought we not to establish military posts on
JJiG rout# to Oregon, for the purpose of sheltering
Debate on the Oregon question.
t)«c. 1844.
those emigrants who go there? Certainly, so far as
regards this provision, there can be no question.
There is no doubt but that we have a right to do so,
and it is our duty to presentaprwnafacie one under the
cegis of our own law3. The British government have
done it for years. They have a government there.
The British are protected, while the American citi-
zens are left unprotected. It might be, that when
the Committee on Territories came to consider this
bill, there would be found no difference of opin
ion at all between the two committees. He thought
it one of the first duties of the present Congress of
the United States to send the protection of our laws
apross the Rocky mountains. There was a mere asso-
ciation there, without law. American citizens there
have a right to be protected, according to the con-
struction put upon the treaty by the British govern-
ment. They have a right, and have exercised that
right, to protect their own citizens; and ought we
not to establish some form to protect ours? For
one, therefore, he would vote for the reference of
this bill to the Committee on Territories; and when
he saw the bill as reported, and something pointed
out in the state of the negotiation with which it
might interfere, he would then, and not till then, be
prepared to say whether its provisions conflicted
with the interests of the country and a foreign gov-
ernment.
_ Mr. ATCHISON called for the yeas and nays on
his motion to refer the bill to the Committee on
Territories; and they were ordered.
The vote was then taken, and resulted—yeas 21,
nays 24, as follows:
YEAS—Messrs. Allen, Ashlej-, Atchison, Atherton,
Bagby, Benton, Breese, Buchanan, Colquitt, Bickinson,
Fairfield, Foster of New York, Hannegan, Haywood, Hneer
Niles, Semple, Sturgeon, Tappan, Walker, and Woodbury
NAYS—Messrs. Archer, Barrow, Bates, Bayard, Berrien
Choate, Clayton, Crittenden, Evans, Foster of Tennessee'
Francis, Huntington, Johnson, Mangum, Merrick, Miller'
Morehead, Tearce, Phelps, Porter, Rives, Upham, White
and Woodbridgo—21. '
So the motion did not prevail.
Mr. WALKER observed that, if it was now in
order, he would move to refer the bill to a select
committee.
The CHAIR said that the motion of the senator
from Virginia would have precedence, being one of
reference to a standing committee.
Mr. WALKER said, before that vote was taken,
h? would state, that during the last nine years at
least, as the journals of the Senate whould show,
the bill for the occupation of Oregon, and for framing
a territorial government there, had been uniformly
referred to a special committee, and the friends of
Oregon had, at least until this session, been permit-
ted to present their views through a committee
favorable to their objects; and now, for the first
time, if this special committee be refused, the bill is
referred to the Committee on Foreign Relations; and
the friends of this great and important measure will
be refused the privilege of presenting their views in
relation to this matter, through the report of a com-
mittee. For these reasons, he should vote against
the reference of this bill to the Committee on For-
eign Relations, hoping, if that motion should not
prevail, that the course which had heretofore been
uniformly adopted by the Senate might again pre-
vail; and that the friends of the bill might have it
referred to a committee favorable to its objects, to
be appointed by the Preside."t of this body. He
asked the yeas and nays on the motion to refer it to
the Committee on Foreign Relations
Mr. ARCHElI had a sjiii;]e remark to mnke in
reply to the honorable senator from Mississippi;
and that was, that the motion to refer to a special
committee amounted to the same as that which had
been voted upon, a^d v Inch the Senate hud lefu:;? d.
He hoped, therefore, that the motion would not pre-
vail.
Mr. ALLEN said he hoped thot th^ motion to
refer to the Committee on Foreign Relations would
not prevail. He was fearful that we were retrogra-
ding upon this question. It was between two and
three years ago that this body passed a bi!l intro-
duced by the late lamented senator from Missouri,
[Mr Linn,] contemplating the very object of the
bill now before the Senate; and nowj a few years
after, the body us prepared to abandon the subject
altogether. We are prepared to inform the British
minister in the capital, by our tardiness and negli-
gence of actK-n, that we have no great solicitude
about our title in that Territory. We are aiding,
by the mdifTeicncc which we are exhibiting upon
this subject, the British minister in his negotiation
Senate.
against us. We are giving him the earnestof our
ludinerence as an encouragement to him to strength-
en British domination. We are told that the
subject must go to the Committee on Foreign kela-
toons, because a negotiation ia going on; and we are
told it in the facftof the executive message by which
Congress is urged to take the very steps contempla-
ted by this bill—advised by that officer who ia
charged with the foreign negotiation, the pendency
of which is now urged as a reason for not pursuing
the course which the President advises, and the biB
contemplates. The President, in giving his opinion
was certainly not ignorant of the state of the negoti'
ation. He conducts the negotiations, and must be
aware of every stage which the present negotiation
has gone through since the last meeting of Congress.
Did he notknow, as well as the Committee on For-
eign Relations, whether such was the condition of
the _ negotiation as would justify Congress in inter-
posing its legislation upon this subject? He has ad-
vised it; and by that advice he (Mr. A.) took it
for granted that there was in the present stage of the
negotiation no objection to the action of Congress
upon this subject; and if so, all the arguments which
had been urged by the head of the Committee on
Foreign Relations passed at least for inconclusive.
The yeas and nays had been called; and he
had deemed it nccessary to make this explanation.
Mr. WALKER apprehended that the senator
from Virginia [Mr. Archer] was entirely mistaken
in supposing that the Senate had already decided
'that this matter should be referred to the Committee
on Foreign Relations. If that were the case, there
would be no necessity for the vote now about to be
taken. The Senate had simply decided that it should
not be referred to the Committee on Territories, but
had not decided that it should be referred to the
Committee on Foreign Relations. Now, he desired
to know why it was that the course in relation to
this great measure should be different from that
which had always heretofore prevailed; and that the
Senate should now, for the first time, adopt another?
Ever since this measure was first introduced, nine
years since, by the late lamented senator from Mis-
souri, the friends of the measure had uniformly been
permitted to refer it to a special committee. He
asked, then, if justice did not require that reference,
since no change had taken place in the question?
Why introduce a different course this session from
what had heretofore prevailed? Why was it that
having always been permitted to have it referred to
a committee of its friends—a committee that would
examine its details, mature and perfect it, and pre-
sent it in that form most acceptable to the friends of
the measure—why should they now be denied that
privilege? and why should the bill be referred to a
committee whose opinions had been deliberately
announced in the Senate as hostile to it? He had
heard no satisfactory reason why a different
course should be pursued this session from that
which had been adopted heretofore; and believing
that none such could be suggested, he hoped that the
motion to refer the bill to the Committee on Foreign
Relations would fail, and that the friends of the
measure would have an epportunity of referring it to
a committee of its friends, who would perfect its de-
tails, and present it in the form in which they con-
sidered it most acceptable; and then, when this op-
portunity is afforded, if the chairman of the Com-
mittee on Foreign Relations [Mr. Archer] should
still be of opinion that the bill, when perfected, con-
tained principles which v.-ould require its reference
to that committee, then it will be time enough fur
that refprepco.
J\j i\ DhiiViC'N" rnr-T to r. rcmnik upon the
apparition of a Bntish claim to Oregon as on obsta-
cle to American !(gishUi..n upon the'subject. Ilow
long was thai apparition to paraiy/.e. C<"'ngie,ss! In
loxH, wnen air. hioyd iibrought U>; w rd the
proposition to occupy Oregon, it fust npnrared,and '
has continued to apfttir'excr si.,<•<>. Legislation
has been prevented on this subject for near a quarter
of a century; how long is it to cominui? In 1825
he (Mr. B.) had spoken on this subject, Eh.! hail
then noticed the British lntei ferenee as en obstacle
which had delayed the occupation of Oregon for
four years; he thought that time lonjr, but now it is
near twenty-four years, and the same objection ap-
pears again.
Mr. B then read a passage from his speech of
1SS5, in these words:
"In 192], when the occupation of the Columbia was first
presented to the consideration of Congress, the British min-
ister at Washington (Mi. Canning) fivice called npon the
Secretary of state, (Mr Adams.) with a rjew to arrest ths
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United States. Congress. The Congressional Globe, Volume 14: Twenty-Eighth Congress, Second Session, legislative document, 1845; Washington D.C.. (https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth2366/m1/470/: accessed May 12, 2024), University of North Texas Libraries, The Portal to Texas History, https://texashistory.unt.edu; crediting UNT Libraries Government Documents Department.